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8/05/2020 12:01 pm  #31


Re: Things people keep getting wrong (Round 2) redux

zuckyd1 wrote:

Loki wrote:

I don't have any doubt though, as I can cheat; I have access to something those sites don't, the script for the issue

It never occurred to me that that would be one of the resources handbook writers might consult. Makes sense though, and probably very useful!

It's not something we always have - Marvel doesn't just automatically share scripts with us. However, we do have a selection provided when they were relevant to imminent handbook entries, which is why I happened to have the one for Secret Avengers I#22.

 

8/06/2020 1:16 pm  #32


Re: Things people keep getting wrong (Round 2) redux

I'm updating the listing at https://cmro.travis-starnes.com. Is this Captain Scotland's first and only appearance?

 

8/06/2020 1:23 pm  #33


Re: Things people keep getting wrong (Round 2) redux

zuckyd1 wrote:

I'm updating the listing at https://cmro.travis-starnes.com. Is this Captain Scotland's first and only appearance?

I believe so. I'm working on a Corps entry for the Appendix, so it's conceivable I might stumble across another one, but I suspect not.

 

8/07/2020 4:30 pm  #34


Re: Things people keep getting wrong (Round 2) redux

I think this points to one thing to remember about comics storytelling: especially if they have dialogue or perform some significant action, identify the characters by dialogue or captions. I'm not singling out any one writer here, but there's been times when I've been reading a comic and felt that to understand what was going on I should know who someone is for the story to work but didn't. I get in this case Captain Scotland probably wasn't a big player in that story, but the resulting confusion some people had there reminded me of a larger problem in comics storytelling (at least in my mind).


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8/16/2020 2:53 pm  #35


Re: Things people keep getting wrong (Round 2) redux

zuckyd1 wrote:

I'm updating the listing at https://cmro.travis-starnes.com. Is this Captain Scotland's first and only appearance?

Oh yeah, and btw, though I'm not sure it's widespread enough to include as a "keep getting wrong", that's not Kaptain Briton in Secret Avengers (2010)#22 either. Guy with a somewhat similar mask, sure, but (a) I've already noted that many of the Corps have similar costumes, for obvious reasons; (b) Kaptain Briton is dead (and yes, I know the Corps could reverse that, but); (c) he's a sadistic and murderous alternate of Brian who tried to rape Betsy - given Brian was running the Corps, do you really he think he'd let that guy be a member? 

Plus, Kaptain Briton was a blond like Brian, and has a blue neck, below which is a white V then a red chest
https://comicvine1.cbsistatic.com/uploads/square_medium/0/229/135899-153805-kaptain-briton.jpg

while this guy has brown hair, and his costume has a blue neck (match), red V (not a match) and white torso (not a match). 
https://comicvine1.cbsistatic.com/uploads/original/8/85763/7522769-notkaptainbriton.jpg


Also seeing Britanicus Rex stated to be in the issue. The only obviously non-human Corpsman present is this guy:
https://comicvine1.cbsistatic.com/uploads/original/8/85763/7522785-notbr.jpg

who is green skinned, square headed, has a scrawny build and has no chin guard on his mask, unlike Britannicus Rex
https://comicvine1.cbsistatic.com/uploads/square_medium/0/77/260187-149845-britanicus-rex.jpg

who is pink skinned, has a more pointy jaw (not so obvious from the shot above), muscular build and has a chin guard. Unless the artist was having a seriously off day, he wasn't trying to portray Britanicus Rex. Though I believe it's simply a new character the artist drew (the script specifies no other Corps members other than Captain Scotland), there'd be a better case to make for the reptilian guy in SA#22 being Centurianous Britanicosarus:
https://comicvine1.cbsistatic.com/uploads/original/8/85763/7522812-cb.jpg

though given how skinny the guy in SA#22 is compared to Centurianous Britanicosarus, if it is intended to be him, he's apparently starving himself to death.

Last edited by Loki (8/16/2020 2:54 pm)

 

9/07/2020 8:46 am  #36


Re: Things people keep getting wrong (Round 2) redux

I've just watched The New Mutants movie (don't worry, I was socially distanced - there were only three people in the cinema including me). The following bit isn't spoilery imo - I've deliberately avoided saying anything that I think amounts to being an actual spoiler, but for the sake of those who want to avoid anything even vaguely spoilery, I'll put things into spoiler tags until I get to the "thing that people keep getting wrong."

Personally, I don't think it's the disaster some thought it would be; there's some good stuff in there (the visualizations of the main threat, and the depiction of the characters' powers, for example), the acting is fine, there are a few nice nods to the other X-Men movies (some more subtle than others), and the script is...okay. No outright terrible bits like the stuff that plagued the first two Wolverine movies, both Dark Phoenix movies, and Apocalypse, but nothing that makes you go "Woah!" either. But why am I mentioning this here, in the "Things People Keep Getting Wrong" thread, rather than as a movie review? Because it also showcased one of the common errors I've previously overlooked. 

There are some continuity issues - I know that it's not the comics, so they can change things, but I still wince every time a movie changes continuity for no good reason. If it serves the story, fair enough, but if it's just change for change's sake, or because the movie maker apparently doesn't understand the source material, that annoys. There's some stuff I won't mention, because it amounts to potential spoilers, but there are some I feel safe to mention. I think anyone who has seen the cast listing knows they didn't cast black actors to play two characters that are black in the comics. Not fond of that, though I suspect one of those was perhaps because they were trying to match the established continuity of the previous movies, which had already changed the appearance - I'll explain why in another post properly reviewing the movie, with spoiler tags. But that's not the one I want to mention here, which is:

Common error: Rahne Sinclair is a devout Catholic.
Truth: Rahne Sinclair is a devout Protestant, specifically a Scots Presbytarian. 

Rahne's specific denomination was revealed in New Mutants I#12. And it's noteworthy that depicting her as Catholic is a big error, given how far from Catholic her actual denomination makes her, as evidenced by what Reverend Craig told her about Catholicism:
https://comicvine1.cbsistatic.com/uploads/original/8/85763/7556306-presby.jpg

So to see websites and even comics and films depict her as Catholic is irksome. 

Just to be fair, a lot of the story depicts a good understanding of the characters and their comics' continuity, which only makes the times they veer from those more noticable.

 

9/07/2020 5:28 pm  #37


Re: Things people keep getting wrong (Round 2) redux

I only glossed over the last post because I'm waiting for now to watch New Mutants (due to the virus not keen on going to a theatre), but on the topic of movies,  to follow up on a previous question, are you also tracking in your summaries at the start of the thread things people get wrong about Marvel movies and shows, or just things people get wrong about Marvel comic stories? Because most people don't pause movies and shows while they watch, people sometimes miss details or fill in incorrect details.


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9/08/2020 2:54 am  #38


Re: Things people keep getting wrong (Round 2) redux

Andy E. Nystrom wrote:

I only glossed over the last post because I'm waiting for now to watch New Mutants (due to the virus not keen on going to a theatre), but on the topic of movies,  to follow up on a previous question, are you also tracking in your summaries at the start of the thread things people get wrong about Marvel movies and shows, or just things people get wrong about Marvel comic stories? Because most people don't pause movies and shows while they watch, people sometimes miss details or fill in incorrect details.

I am happy to track things people get wrong in the movies and shows, though obviously because the movies and shows are outside 616 continuity, some things are not so much wrong as just the different continuity of the movies or shows. That said, some of those things that differ are unintentional, and caused by the common errors I've listed. I doubt the makers of the Captain America: First Avenger movie actively chose to give Steve Rogers a different real name from the comics version, or spell the Red Skull's real name differently from the correct comics spelling. Instead they assumed what was an error in comics (Steven Grant Rogers rather than the correct Steven Rogers, Johann Schmidt rather than the correct Johann Shmidt) was correct, and made it the correct version for the movies.

That said, now that you mention it, there is one "things people keep getting wrong" regarding the movies that springs to mind, and which appears to be perpetuated across the various wikis.

False: The not yet-gamma powered "Doc" Leonard Samson appeared in The Incredible Hulk movie.
Truth: We've yet to meet the MCU's Leonard Samson. 

This is a very understandable one. In The Incredible Hulk we met Leonard, psychotherapist boyfriend of Betty Ross. A psychotherapist called Leonard associated with the Hulk has to be the future Doc Samson, right? But when it came to the Guidebook of the Marvel Cinematic Universe that covered that movie, we were told he wasn't Doc Samson. Note that the movie only refers to him by his first name. Presumably the plan had to been that if the first MCU Hulk movie had been more successful and spawned sequels, then Leonard might have been revealed as Doc Samson down the line, but when that plan was dropped, a decision had been made to keep the options open for how to use/introduce Doc Samson down the line by no longer tying him to Betty's boyfriend of similar name and profession. 

 

9/08/2020 7:21 am  #39


Re: Things people keep getting wrong (Round 2) redux

I definitely get the different reality bit. I meant strictly internal continuity. Two examples I previously mentioned:
Incorrect: Galactus in Fantastic Four: Rise of the Silver Surfer was a cloud.
Truth: You briefly see the shadow of Galactus's helmet within the cloud, suggesting that the cloud isn't him but rather obscuring his actual features. So he was actually within the cloud.

My suspicion is the filmmakers were trying to make Galactus seem more godlike by not showing him directly. Unfortunately instead this resulted in people assuming what they could most easily see was in fact him.
 
[Regarding Agents of SHIELD season 1]: Even though it's quite a few years old I know at least one person who's watching it for the first time and others who plan to get to the show at some point, so I'll include spoiler tags. This error even made it into the book Agents of SHIELD: Season One Declassified (rewriting below to match the usual format).

Incorrect: Right before before Grant Ward murders Victoria Hand and other agents, Hand gives Ward her gun, which he uses to commit the murders.
Truth: In actuality he uses his own gun.

 
And a new one:
Incorrect: The X-Men appeared in the Marvel Superheroes cartoon series from the 1960s
Truth: In the strictest sense, the X-Men don’t appear in the cartoon. However, the Alliance for Peace, whose membership is identical to that of the original X-Men appear in a Sub-Mariner episode that was part of that series.
 


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9/08/2020 8:12 am  #40


Re: Things people keep getting wrong (Round 2) redux

One more, though this one may be a case of who do you believe.

[Probably] Incorrect: Bruce Banner's name was changed to David because CBS thought Bruce sounded too gay.
[Probably] Correct: The name change was done to avoid the comics trope of alliteration.

Now both Stan Lee and Lou Ferrigno have claimed the former while showrunner Kenneth Johnson has claimed the latter. Lee had a notoriously bad memory and Ferrigno may not have been privy to things going on in the executive level. However, Johnson as the showrunner would definitely have known if there was any validity to the "too gay" claimed and he's denied that claim, so I'm more inclined to believe the latter. He also wanted to make the Hulk red so he was certainly not shy about moving things away from the comics without any push from CBS.


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